Letter from a listener, introducing our newest employee at BTDC, and a “hard hitting” interview with Smithers.
Bikethrow.com: New BTDC Employee and Interview with Smithers - Episode #17 [36:25m]: Play Now | Play in Popup | DownloadNew BTDC Employee and Interview with Smithers - Episode #17
Bikethrow.com: New BTDC Employee and Interview with Smithers - Episode #17 [36:25m]: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download
Comments 25
Not to dwell on the negative, but, for the record, one of the other main points of my email to BTDC was about online openness/reception. One significant gateway to the cycling scene is online, and BTDC is a really good way to offer an in to any newcomers, not just from those who happen to be elsewhere, which is my current perspective, but also from interested Minnesotans, currently in-state, looking to start racing for the first time.
However, when someone comments sincerely on BTDC, intending to start a healthy a discourse or even just ask a question, usually there’s only one serious response and then 10-20 sarcastic squibs between a bunch of regulars, all with nicknames that newcomers would have trouble connecting to names and faces of racers. I think that that tendency creates a significant exclusionary feeling in the scene. Many who aren’t already rooted in it may get apprehensive about participating online and maybe even at races too.
I think MN cycling should try to be more aware of this. The scene could grow a bunch more—and it deserves to—but it needs to keep opening its arms.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 2:35 pm ¶Who is Seth Meyer?
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 3:13 pm ¶Who is tone?
Only 18 sarcastic squibs to go!
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 3:32 pm ¶Seth,
I don’t understand what you would like to see happen. Do you want to be able to post a comment that says “Hi, I’m Seth, and I’m a cyclist.” and everyone will give you a big hug and lead you out in the next race?
Bike racing is competetive, and as such will present some difficulties in welcoming new members. This is true in all facets of life, why would you expect it to be any different in cycling? It’s like going to a new school. You can’t just show up one day and be the cool kid. You have to prove yourself and make your own friends.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 3:36 pm ¶You know, that’s a very good point. I hear you loud and clear, and I understand you don’t know what I’m asking for. Now that I think of it, neither do I.
I happened to write my letter to BTDC when I was reflecting on chicagobikeracing.com and the differences between the two sites and scenes. I guess I just found it a little disappointing that the Chicago area seems to do a much better job of encouraging newcomers and making them feel welcome at races and online. My speculation was that the mood/environment online may have been a part of that.
Specific ideas no how to remedy that? I don’t have much and I don’t want to look like a stiff who is trying to take away people’s fun either (I like to have my own too!), but I would really say that the BTDC comments sections would be a good place to start.
Whether or not that’s a reasonable thing to consider—I don’t know. Of course it’d be silly to limit any freedom to speak—either on-topic or snidely and completely off-topic—and I guess if 20-30 people just want to be sarcastic and poke fun at each other, then that’s that.
Now I wouldn’t ask for a hug and a leadout or anyone to even thing I’m cool. I would just ask for a little more openness—maybe poke your fun, make your points, but also ASK other people what they think or if there’s a different way to look at things. When people see they’d only get made fun of for trying to make a serious point, even if they don’t have a good one, but just want to raise an issue, the issue may never be raised.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 3:54 pm ¶On one of my first ever blog post, I stated that the following pisses me off:
“Cryptic blogs that have a [lewd reference] circumference of about 3 people”
http://www.nickelnuts.com/2006/10/13/things-that-piss-me-off-v2/
Because I was outside the blogging community, the obscure references bugged me. It doesn’t bother me now because I’ve started to filter out most of the noise and focus on who/what I want to read. I agree that it is difficult to have a coherent dialog via comments though. Which is a shame, because I think that most of the value (for a site like BTDC) can comments.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 3:55 pm ¶i too have thrown seth off the track… it was after a discussion involving atw, logan square, punk rock cycling ….etc. but really, the bike culture in mpls does tend to show ‘em the horns… if i hadn’t been born and bred in spaces more dangerous than the twin towns, i too would be hiding in the shadows. ya see, i don’t care for none of these smither’s and skibb’s and oh hell,atw even bugs me ocassionally., but we’re family and i don’t have ta like ‘em cause i love ‘em. keep yr mouth shut if ya know whats good for ya, that’s right, i said love
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:00 pm ¶I’m also converted.. it’s like meeting people all over again.. AND you can hate the virtual person and like the real person.. hate both.. love both.. or any combo therein
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:00 pm ¶PS i only have a 3 minute attention span (stupid ADD) can anyone summarize the smithers interview?
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:02 pm ¶as far as the nicknames thing, i don’t think it’d make a difference one way or the other. at races people are going to socialize with people they know whether they know them by name or by some blog-o pseudonym. i’m not a very outgoing person and have a better rapport with people on the net than in person. i’ve seen some of these people at dozens of races and never really spoken to them. for example — these are the only words ever exchanged between myself and smithers face to face:
me: would you care for some cashews?
smithers: no thanks, they give me cashew butt.
[end scene]
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:03 pm ¶oh satan, we need to meet outside the blog call me at … why would i let out my phone #, all the way has it, let’s start the new year out right, on a peace train folks….it’s a long way to cx season when it all hangs outs
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:05 pm ¶one of my favorite moments at the post race one on one party post state cross was when snide (snideblog.com) aka jason snider asked me ‘hey timmer, is that super rookie?’
and later; superrookie ‘timmer, which one is snider?’
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:14 pm ¶I sympathize Seth, but what did you expect from BTDC as a self appointed community center for Minnesota cycling? It’s really just a blog, which allows for the perfect storm of Internet virtual personna smarminess to intersect with roadie elitest snobbery.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:25 pm ¶Thanks Dan, for the ringing endorsement. You don’t know how touched I am…
You can label it however you want, or characterise the patrons in whatever manner you choose. This site is read/write and will remain so because the community does provide more than the articles themselves. If, in your wisdom, that is what you call a blog, fine, I don’t care - you can call it a bagel for all I care.
Our goal has been to add value to MN cycling. If we are doing that now and continue to, great, otherwise it will go away as soon as I’ve personally flamed all of my enemies to the point of libel.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:37 pm ¶Tone-
Seth Meyer is a good rider from Chicago. Cat1 racer. You should look him up the next time you are looking for someone to come race at your Stage Race.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:39 pm ¶who be dan i?
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 4:46 pm ¶Is “Seth Meyer” a nickname? There was an interview with smithers in the biketoss this week? When? I started tuning out after awhile. Timmer, did I meet snide at the One on One party/ It seems to me I should know him but I can’t remember why or how.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 5:00 pm ¶is this a message board? see everyone at grumpy’s december 28 for another coldsprint… think it’s still on
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 5:32 pm ¶Q: who is dan i? A: A lowly masters cat 4. You can find my name in MTB, road, and CX racing in these parts.
BTDC people, I really do like what you’re doing. I was just practicing my Internet smarminess.
FWIW, a more “friendly” communication vehicle would be a message board that’s actually moderated. The whole anonymous/nickname user thing is a red herring. It goes with the territory on the Internet, and trying to get people to shed their virtual personnas is just anti-social.
IMHO, if you want to have healthy and useful discussions, then set some ground rules on what is acceptable stuff to post and then have someone moderate. This works pretty well on morcmtb.org or roadbikereview.com for instance.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 5:41 pm ¶that’s just it dan.. we already have that. otherwise it’s individual’s blogs.. there’s no disputing that blogs and blogging are a strong outlet of communication and it’s better to work with it than around it. darren and tim moderate it just fine.. seems to me you wanna be the one stirring the pot. i’ve yet to see an ‘elitest’ roadie post (that wasn’t well argued anyway he he)
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 5:59 pm ¶timmer … I’m not complaining. The blogs are fine. The “elitist” thing was a joke (followed by smiley face for emphasis ya know).
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 6:17 pm ¶The term “MN nice” is often recited by minnesotans. I did the smallest stage race in Iowa and I can stay the reception is much warmer among people without inflated images of themselves. My experiences racing out of state have been extremely pleasant. Superweek, they gave me 5 free laps in a crit…
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 9:21 pm ¶me: would you care for some cashews?
smithers: no thanks, they give me cashew butt.
I don’t remember that, but I’m certain it’s true.
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 9:43 pm ¶Seth,
You should race at the NSC Velodrome. We are much nicer than the road racers. Contrary to what Taylor wrote, the MN roadies provide lead outs all the time at the track:)
Posted 19 Dec 2007 at 9:52 pm ¶I’m nice, ask my mommy.
Posted 20 Dec 2007 at 4:31 pm ¶Trackbacks & Pingbacks 2
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